[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hey, thanks so much for listening to this message. My name is Jason and I'm one of the ministers here at the Madison Church of Christ. It's our hope and prayer that the teaching you hear today will bless your life and draw you closer to God. If you're ever in the Madison area, we'd love for you to stop by and study the Bible with us on Sundays at 05:00 p.m. or Wednesdays at 07:00 p.m. if you have questions about the Bible or want to know more about the Madison church, you can find us
[email protected] dot. Be sure to subscribe to this podcast as well as our Sermons podcast Madison Church of Christ Sermons. Thanks again for stopping by. I hope this study is a blessing to you.
Okay, so we're going to actually go back.
And I know it's been three weeks since I've been over here and Robert's been over there, so I'm feeling a little bit better. Last week I told him I didn't like being over there, so I had to move back over here.
So we are going to talk just briefly about the end of Matthew, chapter 19, and then we're going to move into chapter 20. Now, if you'll remember, at the end of chapter 19, we had gone over the story of the rich young ruler, or the rich young man and the difficulty of riches.
And it was interesting to me, you know, that they're there and that rich young ruler is saying, you know, well, what do I need to do? What do I need to do? Or he's saying, I've done all these things. What else do I need to do? Jesus tells him he goes away sad. Then we have kind of a little bit of a little tangent there where.
Let's see.
I know I had that wrong. That was the children was before that. So the rich young ruler happens. Then after that, Jesus says that it's hard for a rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven.
And then the end of chapter 19, it's kind of interesting to me because it almost seems childish, right? Keep in mind these are grown men here, and they've just seen this, and Jesus has told them about riches and the danger of riches. And then what does Peter do? We're going to look at verse 27. What does Peter do?
[00:02:25] Speaker B: He asked them what they're gonna get.
[00:02:26] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean. I mean, to me, it's very much. It's almost like a little kid. It's almost like, you know, we've done all that. We did all that. What are we gonna get? What are we gonna get? Right. You know, they're, they're wanting to. He's wanting to see what they're gonna get. And that is going to take us into chapter 20. And we'll see in chapter 20 that that theme continues, continues on. And again, I think it's one of those cases like somebody mentioned earlier this quarter.
It's almost kind of bad that the chapter break happens there because it's, you know, this is one continuous sort of narrative here, and you can kind of see a theme building. Robert, do you have anything you want to add there before we jump into chapter 20?
[00:03:15] Speaker B: Why don't we read those last few verses that just to me, really, it's a lead into chapter 20.
[00:03:21] Speaker A: You want to read them?
[00:03:22] Speaker B: Yeah. Starting with chapter 27 where we just talked about Peter saying, see, we have left everything after hearing the story of the rich young ruler who turned and left what he needed to do. And then Jesus talks about the difficulties that riches cause us.
They say, well, we did. We did leave everything to David's point. So what do we get? He says, jesus says, truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the son of man will sit on his glory, on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands for my sake, will receive a hundredfold and will inherit eternal life.
So what's happening here? They ask, what's in it for me? What do I get as my reward? Because I have given up everything a reward's promised, right?
And he gets somewhat specific in describing that. And then verse 30, a little bit odd and kind of leaves them hanging a little bit, you might wonder exactly why that came in right there. But he says, but many who are first will be last and the last first.
And as we read in chapter 20, we're going to get a little more glimpse of that and a repeat of that. So let's just go ahead and dive into 20. I don't know if you want to break it down as we go or read the.
[00:05:00] Speaker A: I was going to also point out there, just sort of, again, behind the scenes here, did the apostles at this point, did they really get what he was talking about?
They're thinking in earthly terms, right? And so I do think it's, you know, at least I try to kind of put my myself in that, that mindset. Like, what are they thinking? And then, then when he says, you know, oh, if you give those things up, you're going to get more of that. You're going to get more than that in return. And even as we're reading it tonight, I find myself asking, did they really understand that? You know, did they understand, or did they, you know, and, I don't know, did they maybe get excited and be like, oh, oh, you know, we're, you know, we're going to get something. What's, you know, what's going to happen? And to Robert's point, as we go into chapter 20, we'll see that continuing on. Now, we got a fairly large piece here that is one through 16 there. Would somebody like to read one through seven? And then somebody read eight through 16? Who wants to do one through seven?
All right, Keith's going to do that. And then eight through 16. Who would like to do that?
Okay, Brent and y'all just, just keep it moving. I'm going to step out this way in the hopes that Mike will pick some of that up. So go ahead, please. Keith. For the kingdom of heaven is like a master of a house who went out early in the morning to hire laborers for his vineyard.
After agreeing with the laborers for a denarius a day, he sent them into his vineyard. And going out about the third hour, he saw others standing idle in the marketplace, and to them he said, you go into the vineyard too, and whatever is right, I will give you. So they went, going out again about the 6th hour and the 9th hour he did the same.
And about the 11th hour, he went out and found others standing, and he said to them, why do you stand here idle all day? They said to him, because no one has hired us. He said to them, you go into the vineyard too.
When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, call the laborers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last group to the first.
When those hired about the 11th hour came, each one received a denarius. When those hired first came, they thought they would receive more, but each of them also received a denarius. When they received it, they grumbled at the landowner, saying, these last men have worked only 1 hour, and you have made them equal to us, who have borne the burden and the scorching heat of the day.
But he answered and said to one of them, friend, I am doing you no wrong. Did you not agree with me for Denarius, take what is yours and go. But I wish to give to this last man the same as to you. Is it not lawful for me to do what I wish with what is my own, or is your eye envious because I am generous? So the last shall be first and the first last.
Okay, thank you all.
[00:08:27] Speaker B: So how does the parable start? What are we talking about here?
The very first verse.
Talking about the kingdom of heaven.
It's like what?
This lays the groundwork for the story.
He's like the master of the vineyard or landowner or master of the house. Different versions read.
So we're talking about the kingdom of heaven, and it's like a master.
So it's very spiritually aligned in my mind early on here.
Let's see the other interesting points as we read through that they make an agreement with those before we go there. The time. Does everybody understand the time? The way we're measuring time in this discussion here? The day was. The hours of the day were 06:00 a.m. to 06:00 p.m. essentially. And then there was the night. So when we say the certain hour of the day, it's the hours past 06:00 a.m. so those laborers that he hired first were there very early.
And what happened there as far as hiring them?
[00:09:49] Speaker A: They're the only ones that he actually made an agreement for a salary.
[00:09:53] Speaker B: They did that. Both parties agreed on what the pay for that day of work was going to be. I think that's an important point in the story.
So then he goes out at the third hour, which would have been like 09:00 a.m. and there's others standing there, and he hires them.
What was the agreement there?
[00:10:16] Speaker C: What do you think is right?
[00:10:17] Speaker B: What is fair or right? We didn't sign up to the denarius, did we? The exact amount that the other laborers agreed to. And he goes out several more times, the 6th hour, the 9th hour, even the 11th hour, which means, how long did those folks work?
About an hour.
So, setting the stage there, then the landowner says, go pay these folks. Go pay the laborers. At the end of the day, was there something unique about the way he said to pay them?
Reverse order.
Reverse order, or pay the last first, the last hired first, and the first hired last.
That's interesting, isn't it?
Purposeful, you think, to this story?
I think so.
So he pays them, and to the surprise of those that had been out there for 12 hours working, the first ones that get paid, who just worked an hour, get the same thing that they agreed to, contracted, if you will, to be paid for their day.
But what do they do after it gets to them for their pay? They probably expected to be rewarded more, right?
Because they were there the longest part of the day. But what happens?
They get the same amount that they agreed to, that the guy that worked an hour got paid.
So where's our mind going in this story? And I don't know where we are.
[00:12:03] Speaker A: That's what I was going to say. I'm not sure I've got the slide.
[00:12:06] Speaker B: Go ahead and advance it.
Where does our mind go in this story about this agreement to work and then others getting paid more than what do we relate it to? I would have felt the same way.
[00:12:26] Speaker A: As the ones grown.
Doesn't seem fair.
[00:12:30] Speaker B: Doesn't seem fair.
And I'll give both of those answers because I think it's very relatable to human nature today.
And I think I'd feel the same way, and I think we often do in our workplace. You know, there's always that person that continues to get promoted, like, what am I doing wrong? You know, what? Kind of jealous. But we made an agreement to go work right for whatever our salary was.
So there's an earthly application, an earthly lesson to be learned from this.
But the first verse starts off, the story is a description of what, again, the kingdom, the kingdom of heaven is lie.
So now what's our application in those terms, in a spiritual term?
[00:13:25] Speaker A: So before we go, Jeffrey had a comment over there.
Well, it's totally not what you're talking about.
So, I mean, you also just read that and you're like, well, this encourages laziness.
Why should I put forth, you know, 85% effort when I can do 15% and get the full benefit?
That's the scary part of that story.
[00:13:52] Speaker B: And that's a very human nature type of perspective and view that I think we probably see in our world today. That's a good point, but we want to keep that thought and apply it to the spiritual.
[00:14:07] Speaker A: So I've got kind of a tangent I want to go on, and it's got a practical and I think in a spiritual application as well. So the people that went in and agreed to work for Denarius, when they agreed to work for that, were they happy for that?
Yeah, because they agreed to work for it, right?
At the end of the day, they got what they agreed to, but they're now, what?
Unhappy because they don't feel like it's fair.
In this example, who is suffering with this way of thinking, who is suffering?
The first, right. But their situation did not change. Had the other people not shown up, they would have worked, they would have got their denarius and they would have been happy.
Do you see where I'm going?
It's illogical. I mean, we will all sit here and we'll say, oh, it's not fair. It's not fair.
But it only I'm going to say feels unfair to them. Why? Because they know what the other person is getting. If they had not witnessed it, would they care?
No.
[00:15:32] Speaker B: Back to was their intent in the way that they were the laborer.
[00:15:36] Speaker A: I will tell y'all, I couldn't. I couldn't get it. It's something. It's a. They showed this to us at work years ago. Some of you may have seen it. They did this, this study to see if fairness was something that animals could understand. And it's a hilarious video where they. Have y'all seen it? Have y'all seen this? Go look it up. It's on YouTube. All you have to type in is monkey grape cucumber. Okay? And they have. They train these monkeys to go pick up a rock and drop it in a bucket. And if they do that, they give them a cucumber and the monkeys are sitting there doing it and they're loving it. They're going, they're getting their cucumber and then they take one of the monkeys and they give him a grape and it's absolutely hysterical because you literally see the monkey eating his cucumber. And then he goes and he can see the other monkey eating a grape and he drops his cucumber. He goes and gets another rock, drops it in, he goes back out and he does this. And they hand him a cucumber and he looks at it and then he throws it at the guy. And it's a literal, it's literally, you know, monkeys doing a very similar kind of thing. And it's. The study was about fairness and they showed us this at work to talk a little bit about that. But that's the tangent I wanted to go on is so many times the practical application here is to Robert's point in the workplace, it's going to happen, right? There's going to be things that we feel like are unfair, but is it really? And if we get upset and been out of shape, and I do, I've been there and we're all going to do that sort of thing.
Who is the one suffering?
Us. The other person's fine or the other people are fine. We're the ones suffering. Although many times we're getting exactly what we agreed to. So what their intent was to be the first there and get the best position. That was their.
The difference between humility, that's a good point. And the humble person is really the one that's more important. Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely.
I've worked with this several times. But I kind of thought considering all the sinning that we do as people, just getting in the gate of heaven, that's going to be absolutely wonderful for me. I don't care what anybody else gets. I just want to get in that gate. Right.
Absolutely.
It's also a spiritual gate. It's not a physical gate. Right.
From that standpoint, no matter how long we work, we don't deserve what we.
[00:18:36] Speaker B: That's goodness. Thank God we don't have.
[00:18:41] Speaker A: I also, you know, I think it's. And Robert hit it pretty hard there.
Verses 13 and 13 through 15.
And I do think it's. It's important. It goes back to this point y'all are making. What does the master end up saying? It is not. Is it not lawful for me what to do what I want with what I own?
Right. And I think. I think that's interesting also, just to go back a little bit. What's a denarius? Do you guys remember? It's generically what?
It's about a day's wage, right? So this guy clearly is handing out denarii like they're nothing. So did he have a lot more than a few denarii?
I think that goes back to where I think Robert's probably going, which is.
[00:19:38] Speaker B: You could also look at that denarius as at least what I have read and studied. It allowed someone to feed their family for that day. That's effectively the equivalency of it.
[00:19:50] Speaker A: I had not thought about until we started discussing this. The ones that have been standing around all day. Yeah. The first thought is, well, it's not fair, but they can stand there all day hoping for a job.
Just hoping.
And I just never really thought of it in that term.
[00:20:08] Speaker B: When they were asked why, they said, well, nobody's hired us.
[00:20:13] Speaker A: Yeah, they were. Again, to where we're going. I think there's multiple layers here. These are the, you know, these weren't the chosen people. And I wonder, and I've wondered this for years. I've never heard it even really taught this way. But I wonder, you know, this was of course, before the church was set up. But I wonder if the Jews, you know, if there's some application there, right. They were. They were the first chosen, right. And then it's going to be opened up to the people that were gentiles. The outcasts. Right. Or not the outcasts. But everybody else, right. Not the chosen, their perspective. Yeah.
[00:20:52] Speaker B: Of that from a spiritual. We don't have a picture of them. I mean, they might have been the.
[00:20:57] Speaker A: Ones that looked weaker. Yeah.
[00:20:59] Speaker B: Maybe they weren't picked because these other people, like they're going to do a better job if they weren't passed over. We don't know.
[00:21:06] Speaker A: Yeah, but basically just saying, can I.
[00:21:09] Speaker B: Be merciful with my own money when I want to, or whatever.
And to that point, let's, let's not ignore the fact that the master has gone back to this place multiple times during the day.
Why did he just realize he needed more? I mean, we're making a lot of similarity and assumption here, but to me it fully aligns with the spiritual concept of it in that the denarius allowed that family to be fed for a day, and he went at the 11th hour, and there's still people who didn't have potentially food for the day. And that master had mercy, in my opinion, and maybe that's what he was wanting to do. Does that make sense?
[00:22:03] Speaker A: Those people at the 11th hour are going to be so much more appreciative.
[00:22:06] Speaker B: Of what he did for them when he didn't have to.
[00:22:09] Speaker A: I've seen that my granddad owned a farm, and people that he'd bring in that, I mean, were in prison and nobody else wanted them, nobody else would hire them.
[00:22:20] Speaker B: They bring them in and I mean.
[00:22:21] Speaker A: I've talked to several throughout the years. They're always like, big granddad's one of the nicest people that I've ever worked for because he gave me a chance that nobody else would. And that's always kind of stuck with me. It's like, man, that's just one of the things I want to have that opportunity.
[00:22:36] Speaker B: That's awesome. What were the last words of chapter 19 and the last words of this section of chapter 20?
What was that?
[00:22:46] Speaker A: Somebody last will be first.
I think they're planting the seeds for.
[00:22:51] Speaker C: Them to start thinking spiritually not earthly, that this is going to be a.
[00:22:57] Speaker A: Whole new way of.
[00:23:03] Speaker B: Very wholeheartedly. I think that's a good point.
[00:23:05] Speaker A: I think as we talk about it, the thing that starts to hit me is, why do you tell them that parable? Because they needed to hear it, right?
And what's interesting is we're gonna move on past here and we're gonna see this still didn't end it, right? And unless we've got, you have some more things, we're going to go ahead and jump on into then verses 17 through 19 I'll read those.
[00:23:32] Speaker B: You got a comment here first?
[00:23:34] Speaker A: I didn't. So are you saying this is still a direct, this parable is another answer to Peter's question.
I mean, you think it's a continuation of that answer?
I do, yes. I mean, I don't know. I would say it's a direct answer, but I think you can see this sort of trend in chapter 19, right?
This guy comes up and says, you know, what do I need to do? And Jesus says, well, you do these things. And the guy says, yep, I've done that. And then Jesus says, okay, well, one more thing you got to do. And he tells him to do something and he's like, he's sad because he's got to go sell all his stuff, and he leaves. Well, then Peter walks up and he says, we've done that. We've given everything.
What are we going to get? And Jesus tells him, last shall be 1st. 1st shall be last. Then again, remember original, there's no chapter break. And then he tells them this story, which literally has, back to Robert's point, the last being paid first and the first being paid, you know, last. So I think it's all a part of that narrative, that theme that's going on. Yeah.
The, when you look at this as talking about the kingdom of God, the landowner I would figure would be God, and he's the one doing the rewarding. And I like right after you mentioned about, is it not lawful for me to do what I want to with my money?
He says, or is it? Or is your eye envious because I'm generous? So I think it's kind of a lesson against envy and jealousy and for contentment and trust in God. One of the versions says, do you begrudge my generosity? Which makes me think, who am I to talk about what God gives to anybody, especially in a spiritual sense, in.
[00:25:35] Speaker B: The kingdom of heaven that Dave's coming earlier, when we see who gets in, you know, it's God's grace.
It's up to him to reward how he wants to.
[00:25:51] Speaker A: This kind of reminds me of when Jesus says, yes, John the Baptist, there's no greater than he is. Probably goes, but it's, I don't know how is he worried that the someone who believes and has not seen how the Jonathan scene would be more blessed or something like that, can't remember exactly how it's word.
[00:26:17] Speaker C: It makes no difference if you were.
[00:26:19] Speaker A: Baptized when you were ten years old or the day before you died. Your reward is not going to be different. Right?
[00:26:29] Speaker C: I was going to say something along the same line of I think maybe some christians are maybe wrong. I think some christians could wrongly also look at it in the same way as, like, I've worked hard and I've done this and that and I've earned, you know, I've done things that God wants me to do. And then this is an extreme case, but a criminal like Jeffrey Dahmer, who claimed, you know, the end of his life, he gave his life to Christ and people were like, oh, well, he was a horrible person and how are we supposed to, he's not going to be a part of the Lord's kingdom and all of that and everything. It's also towards the same concept of whether it's the sunset of your life or your adolescence where you're getting your life, that it's not up to us to say we would deserve that and we should be rejoicing in the fact that someone that would have lived their lives would differently come to Jesus in the end. And I wonder if that's also setting up partially for Saul when he's called later. Maybe this is also in some way ahead of this, trying to let them think about this too, because, you know, they were going to be wary of him, rightly so, because he was killing christians. But at the same sense, I wonder if there was some animosity for a while before, and they were like, well, how is he going to, he got to see Jesus on the road to Damascus and he's going to take part in Jesus return and everything as well. And I wonder if it took them some growing pains and thinking about this in the flesh.
[00:28:14] Speaker B: He's really trying to shape their perspective, isn't he?
[00:28:17] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:28:17] Speaker B: And I think we need to let that soak in. So some of those interactions at work, at school, with our children, we may do the same.
[00:28:26] Speaker A: Vic, it seems ironic to me that he starts this section with, from the previous chapter, you will rule in heaven.
[00:28:35] Speaker B: On twelve thrones, judging the tribes of.
[00:28:37] Speaker A: Israel, and then goes immediately into, you know, basically all the stuff you're doing wrong.
[00:28:43] Speaker B: He knows where they're going to end up. I mean, you look at Peter and.
[00:28:46] Speaker A: John rejoicing because they're accounted worthy to suffer. He knows where they're going to be. But there's a lot of teaching has.
[00:28:52] Speaker B: To happen before they get there.
Let's get to our great feedback. Great comments. I appreciate that.
[00:28:59] Speaker A: Let's get to the, so the next, next little piece of it is about the third prediction of Jesus death and resurrection.
And I'll go ahead and read that, it says, as Jesus was about to go up to Jerusalem, he took the twelve disciples aside by themselves. And on the road he said to them, behold, we are going to Jerusalem, and the son of man will be handed over to the chief priests and scribes, and they will condemn him to death, and they will hand him over to the Gentiles to mock and flog and crucify, and on the third day he will be raised up. So in contrast, right to where we started, he's been talking in a parable. And what's he doing right here? He's telling them very specifically and very directly what's going to happen. And I know, we all know what comes after this. Again, as I read this, I think about then, they still didn't get it. Right after that, they still didn't get it. You know, even, even when at the, you know, cruise, the trial, the crucifixion, they still didn't get it. And he's told them what's going to happen there. Did you have an additional thought there.
[00:30:08] Speaker B: That'S got it in the chart that kind of just highlighted some interesting things that each time he is told this, you know, there's a little, some more information added to it, but you can look back at the charts on that.
We want to read this real quick. And then, yeah, I'm, I'll go ahead and catch 2028.
Then the mother of the sons of Zebedee came up to him with her sons, and kneeling before him, she asked him for something.
And he said to her, what do you want? She said to him, say that these two sons of mine are to sit one at your right hand and one at your left in your kingdom. Jesus answered, you do not know what you're asking. Are you able to drink the cup that I am to drink?
They said to him, we're able. He said to them, you will drink my cup. But to sit at my right hand and at my left is not mine to grant, but it is for those for whom it has been prepared by the father.
And when the ten heard this, they were indignant at the other two brothers.
But Jesus called them to him and said, you know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord over them and their great ones exercise authority over them. It shall not be so among you, but whoever would be great among you must be your servant, and whosoever would be first among you must be your slave. Even as the son of man came not to be served, but to serve and to give his life as a ransom for many okay.
[00:31:43] Speaker A: Anybody see any oddities in this story? We're gonna have to move kinda quickly. And this is something that I really enjoy. It's something I mentioned a couple of weeks ago. This is a little bit of, you're gonna get a little bit of my opinion here, but does anybody see any oddities in this story?
[00:31:59] Speaker B: Mother asking?
[00:32:01] Speaker A: Yep.
Right, right.
Like, you know, we would expect, you know, manly men like James and John, they wouldn't do, you know, like a mama's boy or Bart Graham way of like having their mother go, that's the retaliation. Yeah, that's the strawberry remark. Yeah, yeah.
You wouldn't expect that from them, would you? Right. Okay, so you got the first bullet there.
What else about these two guys would make that odd? That the mother would go, really? The family business.
Yep. And those two in particular, they're some of the closest to Jesus. Right, right.
Let's see, this one is, this is a leftover slide from another class that I teach. It's interesting, most of the time in the gospels when somebody goes to Jesus, they actually go through Andrew. If you go and you read, most of the time, Andrew takes people to Jesus. So why did this woman get to go straight to Jesus?
Women weren't considered on equal footing with men at that time. As a matter of fact, just a few weeks ago, when I believe it was, Andrew was talking about, the woman at the well said, this is very odd.
[00:33:30] Speaker B: Right?
[00:33:32] Speaker A: She talked directly to Jesus. Okay. So this was always, was odd to, to me. And I for many years wondered why did James and John's mother go to Jesus? Okay? And I will tell you, I was in my twenties, I was in a Bible class in Cookville, Tennessee, and I asked this question to the teacher, probably shouldn't have, you know, but I asked the teacher and didn't know. The teacher didn't know, had no answer. And a man in the class there, I remember his name, his name was Ray Wilson. And he actually said because she was related to him. And I was like, what? And he never, he couldn't ever prove it to me. And I looked for many, many years to try and figure this out. And when I was teaching the class on the apostles, I got to what I want to show you guys.
If the slide will advance, I'll tell you what we're going to be looking at. And let me get three people to turn to these places we're going to be in.
Looks like it's going to pop up here in a second.
Okay. These three scriptures, Matthew 27 56. Somebody get that and be ready? Okay, somebody get Mark 1540.
And then somebody get John 1925. Now these three scriptures are talking about. They're at the cross and it names the women that are there at the foot of the cross. Okay, so somebody really quickly, Matthew 27 56. What's the name of the first, the first woman that it says there?
[00:35:31] Speaker B: Mary Magdalene.
[00:35:32] Speaker A: Mary Magdalene. Okay, I've spoiled the second one. What's the second one?
[00:35:38] Speaker C: Mary, the mother of James and Joseph.
[00:35:40] Speaker A: And then the final one, the mother.
[00:35:43] Speaker C: Of the sons of Zebedee.
[00:35:44] Speaker A: Okay, another thing that I always wonder here, why did everybody name their daughter Mary, right? I mean, it's just all over. All right, somebody mark 1540.
Read the names please.
[00:35:56] Speaker C: Mary Magdalene.
[00:35:58] Speaker A: Go ahead. Mary, the mother of James and the younger.
[00:36:01] Speaker C: And of Joseph.
[00:36:02] Speaker A: Yep. And Solomon. Okay, all right, now, John 1925. This one, we're going to have to change the order a little bit. But is Mary Magdalene there? Somebody look at that and give me a yes or no.
[00:36:16] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:36:16] Speaker A: Okay.
All right, is Mary the mother of James and Joses there not mentioned. Oh, Mary the wife of Clopas. Okay, and then the final one, his mother and his mother's sister. All right, now if you assume that these lists are the same, what does this mean?
This person over here, James and John's mother is what? Jesus aunt. Jesus aunt. And her name is Salome.
Okay, now the reason this is interesting to me and the reason I teach it is when we get into talking about the apostles and even as we talk, have talked about in this class, all of these things happened. And when I was younger, I always thought these, you know, in particular, like the calling of the twelve and the different things that were going on seemed almost miraculous, right? Like Jesus is walking by the sea and he says, come to me and I will make you fishers of men. You know, it's like this great majestic thing, right?
But if that's true in a town of 1500, what are the chances that if this is true, if they really are his first cousins, what's the chances that James and John haven't talked to Peter and Andrew about their cousin? What's the chances they don't know him? Right. So that's the whole reason I go into this. I do think it's for me personally, it's incredibly interesting to think about that and to think about how small the world currently is and then even how much smaller it was back then. But that was the point I wanted to get to here and I think that'll probably be the last thing we'll be able to get to in chapter 20, any questions there? Any thoughts?
Again, I am making an assumption. I want to make that clear. Okay. It does not explicitly say they were cousins, but if you assume that the lists are the same, then that's what that means.
[00:38:37] Speaker C: That kind of gets reinforced when he gives Mary, his mother, to John.
[00:38:42] Speaker A: That's exactly right. That's exactly right.
Now, interestingly, okay, the relation is through the mother. Right. Mary and Salome. Who else does that make them? A relative of John the Baptist? This was one weird family.
Right.
You know, can you think the other fishermen are like they got a cousin that's living out in the wilderness and this other one is, you know, I mean, think about that. Right?
All right. Any questions? Any comments?
[00:39:21] Speaker C: My american standard?
[00:39:22] Speaker A: And John says, married the wife, his mother's sister. Married the wife of clocuse.
You're saying it says his mother's sister is Mary the wife of Clopas.
Saw his mother and the disciple who he loves, Daniel, by his mother and his mother's sister. Mary, the wife of Clovis and Mary Magdalene. Yes. So it's saying that she's married. No, no. I think it's a listing. It's not saying that his mother, sister. And it's interesting, there are some people that look at it that way. But the stuff I read many years ago was saying it would be very, very odd, even at that time for Mary to have a sister named Mary. So this was a listing.
It's not a parenthetical Mary, the wife of Clopas, his mother's sister. Okay. But there are people that take it that way. All right, sure.
All right. Thank you. All.
